The Stargate Romance Rant... it's been brewing for a while now.

[greyias]

SGA. I love you.

I really do.

I love your teaminess, your crackiness, I adore your snark. I love seeing Bill Nye the Science Guy acting like Rodney, and Rodney the mighty lumberjack as he breaks down a door to be Mr. Hero. I really do.

But we have a problem here.

You suck at (intentional) romance.

You really suck at it, and I've been able to turn a blind eye up to this point. So, while I did enjoy 90% of "Brain Storm" and would have made a happy post o' squee... you're going to make me rant. Because I've been holding it in since "The Shrine".

Okay, see, I enjoyed this episode right up until the very end. I really did. I handwaved the science, and I enjoyed Rodney and Keller's interactions, so I was ready to give them a "Woohoo! You finally figured out how to do roman--DEAR GOD NO! NO! WHY ARE YOU DOING THIS TO ME?" So, uh, despite my intentions to make a squeeful post about every episode... this one's not going to be so much. I do have squee for the episode, I did enjoy it, but the end... sorry guys, I gotta rant.

I really don't mind the idea of McKay/Keller. I really don't. While I prefer that he be single canonically, mostly for selfish ficcing purposes as I've explained to xparrot, I don't mind the idea of him and Keller together. I like her character for the most part, and in theory, it's cute. It's the execution on the show that I'm having problems with.

In theory, I'm not opposed to McKay/Keller. (I aslo hate portmanteus, so I'm going to avoid them for this post.) I think she's a much better match for him than Katie. She seems to actually understand that Rodney is Rodney, and just isn't "having a grumpy day" like I got the impression of Katie in "Quarantine" (and on that ntoe: WTF writers?) She's someone who looks like she'll allow Rodney to be himself, but try to encourage him to tone down other aspects of his personality. I think the "Kinder, Gentler Rodney McKay" is something that's in his mind, and I think she'd probably smack him upside the head if she realized that he was trying to dumb himself down for her.

OFF TOPIC SIDETRAIN - Kind of like John... Honestly, I saw a lot of parallels with her and John in this episode... you probably could have switched them out and not had to change the lines much. Which is, uh, strange. And off topic. And right, I'm supposed to be getting to my rant.

Back on topic, I liked the fact that at the end, Rodney even told her "Screw this! It does matter to me!", because that's our Rodney right there.

But...

I really, really, really, really, REALLY hated the last few seconds of "The Shrine". And I hated the call back to it in this episode just that much more. To break it down:

ONE
Now, I'm sure some people did, and power to them, but there was absolutely no way in the world I can find it cute, flattering, or even the tiniest bit romantic that someone who is mentally regressing to tell me that he loves me. I would find it creepy. And insulting. And there are a lot of reasons why, but it boils down to the fact that it's not really that person telling me that. Part of a person is not a whole person. To me, that basically said, "Part of me loves you. But whole me doesn't."

Yes, yes, I know what they were trying to say is that Rodney with all of his walls and his social awkwardness couldn't say it. (Possibly because the relationship hadn't progressed to the point of LOVE DECLARATIONS? Oh wait, that's point two.) That's not what it said to me though. It basically said to me, "We the writers have absolutely no clue what's romantic, but we think the chicks would dig this, because I think I saw it in a sappy romantic movie my wife/girlfriend/significant other dragged me to once. And she cried, so I guess it worked then."

Of course, I don't cry or get all emotional in most chick flick movies either, so my opinion might not really count here.


TWO
"I've loved you... I have for some time now."

O RLY? YOU HAVE? "FOR SOME TIME NOW"?

Where is my onscreen evidence of this? Where the hell is my build up? Where is the indication that Rodney and Keller hang out and enjoy each other's company before all of this? Where is the indication that they're close friends to where this statement might make one lick of sense? Did it all happen off screen? Maybe it could have. Maybe there was an indication on both sides that things were building up to this point--

McKAY: Jennifer, we practically dated.

KELLER: You bought me one drink! That's hardly dating!

McKAY: Right, so, well now I'm asking you to have dinner with me -- I mean ... (he brandishes the pot again, smiling at her) ... such as it is.

Oh, wait -- there wasn't. In the same fricking episode as mine most hated statement. I can buy, maybe, and that's if you liquor me up a little, that Rodney has fallen for her over the course of "The Shrine" and possibly since "Trio". But... "for some time now"? That's not some time. That's hardly any time.

This statement does not work in real life, hell, this doesn't work in well written television life unless you're in the seventh grade and you're asking out the popular girl you've been oggling all year long in homeroom class. People who have real relationships don't suddenly love someone without a reason. Especially love they've had for a long time now but they've been secretly harborinng. I belive in adult world, we call that a crush. Crushes ≠ Love. Crushes = Crushes.

I really don't mind Rodney and Keller declaring their love for each other, but for the love of the freaking Ori, can you please show me how we get from a beer after "Trio" to TRUE WUB in "The Shrine". I mean, I don't need huge acts of enormity, I just need... actual scenes together? Where they enjoy each other's company. And if we are going to be all trite and have huge sweeping, awkwardly written declarations of love, can we please have our characters be mentally whole and sound while doing so?

THREE
Ah, the cliched classic "callback line". Which works about half the time. (Usually it works better if it made more sense on the first round.) We do have the benefit that they've had more screen time together, and seem to enjoy each other's company. So, character-wise, it can work. It might even work for me if it wasn't so badly written if I didn't hate the original so much.

All right, I'll just be honest here. My pipe dream was that they'd deal with that stupid line properly in the "That was horribly awkward, made me uncomfortable when you said it, but I do have feelings for you" kind of way. Since I know them, and that they thought that was the love declaration for the ages, I was more hoping against hope they'd forget to even address the stupid thing. That way, I could be 100% canon compliant when I wrote things, I could have that as an issue that Rodney and Keller would work through in their relationship, rather than be the foundation for it.

Brain damaged love declarations as the foundation of a relationship. Seriously. SRSLY?

I know it was supposed to be sweet and cute. But for me, it really wasn't.


FOUR
WE LOVE EACH OTHER. LET'S HAVE SEX.

No, no, let's not date each other, make sure we're on the same page, put some emotional foundation on this relationship as we transition from friends to something more. Let's just get down to the part that apparently really matters. We could wait and possibly act like normal people who might have an awkward transition phase, we have a private jet plane now, and we've always wanted to get on the Mile High Club.

I hate it in fanfic, I hate it in shows. A friendship is a relationship. It matters. And it matters that you're going to be friends after you resolve your UST. (That I don't really see, but I don't see it 90% of the time, so my opinion... probably don't count much.) Friends who start to date each other I would expect in most cases would, even if they've wanted to for a while and yearned for it, be terrified and horribly awkward about it.

But then Martin Gero couldn't live out his fantasies vicariously through his writing.


FIVE
This one is all me here, I'll admit. The age thing seriously, seriously is bothering me more than I thought it would (when they start suggesting sexual acts. (I blame dovil's "Creepy Uncle Rodney" rant from last season.) Them kissing is kind of cute, but the thought of something more starts to wig me out. Can we have a statement that Keller is at least thirty? Plz? Because for some reason, fifteenish age year difference really squicks me more than a ten year gap.

On a side note, why can't I think of her as Jennifer in my mind?

In conclusion: I love you show. Why do we have to fight?

Now that I've gotten that off my chest, maybe I can make my regular post o' squee in a little bit. Also! I need to make a birthday post o' squee, because I got presents! :D

Comments

[justtheficsmaam.livejournal.com]

Brain twins we are here.

I was completely willing to surf along on Bill Nye, Neil DeGrasse Tyson and Dave Foley!!!11! squee but NO! they had to bludgeon me with the most horrible romance anvil I've witnessed in a long time!

I'm holding back on capslock by a hairsbreadth.

[aelfgyfu_mead]

A friendship is a relationship. It matters.
Yes, yes, YES! Friendship matters. Lovers should be friends first, both in the temporal sense and in the sense of what matters most. And the writers can often even handle friendship, as opposed to lurve, which they can't handle much at all. (Doesn't Martin Gero have a girlfriend? I mean, really, if I hadn't seen pictures of him with a woman on Mallozzi's blog, I'd think maybe he didn't even know any women beyond acquaintanceship!)

Bill Nye and Neil de Grasse Tyson made me happy, and watching Rodney usually makes me happy and did in spite of the writing last night, so I'm mostly just pretending that certain moments of the show didn't happen. Didn't happen at all. On the plane? What? Just snuggling. Honest. I'm sure of it. I know that if I had nearly died and were still wet or even kinda damp under a blanket, snuggling is what I'd want. (Nearly as much as I'd want to change my clothes before I got on the frigging plane! "No, just use the jet for someone else, and I'll go to the nearest Target and get some pants and a top. Warm ones. Dry ones.")

I think the rubber band gun is too good for Martin Gero at this point. BH says a paintball gun will hurt more. I need to upgrade.

[leesa_perrie]

Um, I get what you're saying but I loved the episode, all of it, and so I guess we'd better just agree to disagree on this one. I know it might seemed rushed, but I guess for me I'm used to TV doing that (or else spinning out for ages and ages until it's gets boring - I prefer the former). Whatever, I loved it, even the bits you didn't (and am more irritated by the medical mistakes, but I'm chosing to ignore them).

On the plus side, this means that, despite evidence to the contrary (our IM chats), we don't actually share the same brain!! *phew*

Minor note: Is it specifically for Rodney/Jennifer that you have a problem with the age gap? I know for some they find it hard for those two charcaters but have no problem with it in real life. Just wondering, seeing as I married a man 16 years my senior and have never regretted it!

[gnine.livejournal.com]

...okay, so, this might get a bit long, apologies in advance :-p.

On your points of why the show oh so loses at writing believable romance, I agree COMPLETELY! All five of your points are spot on! (Including the age thing, which is funny, cause I actually often go for age differences, it's actually kinda a kink. But it disturbs/disappoints me when it's never MENTIONED. One of the things that can be fun/interesting about a big age gap is the adversity that goes with it, proving that your relationship, your bond, transcends your generation gap and the doubts others cast upon it. Except here, no doubts, not even a single raised eye-brow that she's possibly young enough to be his daughter...)

The problem I keep having is I don't see how the relationship *ever* could work. You mention at one point the lack of seeing them just enjoying each other's company previous to "The Shrine". I still find such scenes lacking, up to and including this ep. Keller, nor Rodney for that matter, ever come across like they're really having *fun* with each other. She had to remind him he was sitting with a "beautiful woman." Because the love and lust and UST is such that she has to POINT THIS OUT! Oh show. She spends the entire ep nagging him, asking him to change his conversation, change his personality and pointing out that she's coming only because she's (I guess) interested in him. Past that she keeps stating how much she finds the subject deathly dull. Physics, y'know, Rodney's greatest passion, holds not a single lick of interest for her. And he finds her field equally deplorable, as so much past evidence would suggest. Not that they have to share all their interests. But they have to have *something* in common. And when they're two people who live their careers, having respect/interest in those fields I think does start to really come into play. Heck, they don't even enjoy the same food in this. (poor Rodney and his strawberry phobia *smishes him*)

She doesn't even know him well enough to trust him when he stands up and says this is a BAD PLAN. Instead she just seems to want him to stop embarrassing her. This is *Rodney*, yes, he has an ego, but also, he has that tone he gets when it's all going to hell, when he says we really shouldn't do it and that's when you know you'd better listen cause otherwise the UNIVERSE could be destroyed (or maybe you'll get lucky and it's just the city blowing up...) He's in charge of science on Atlantis, he's saved the day oh so many times. She *knows* this, but still doesn't back him up there.

You mention it coming across like a crush. And that's exactly how it plays to me. Like a high school crush, where they view each other from afar, go "oh, pretty," and when they hook up, realize there's absolutely no substance to their relationship and move on. Except they're not in HS and they've known each other quite some time but aren't moving on, just stumbling awkwardly forward.

*ack* Oh god, sorry for the rant! It's just....the relationship seems so high school from start to finish and the fact they're putting so much screen time into it when there's so little of the show left just frustrates me. *sigh* Ah well...*goes back to huggling my shiny new NCIS. While the fandom's not so large, at least the show is happy-making, and just seems to be getting better...* Oh SGA, as you say, why must we fight? Ah well, there's always all the wondrous, glorious (often better written than canon :-p) fic! ^_-

[xparrot.livejournal.com]

A friendship is a relationship. It matters. And it matters that you're going to be friends after you resolve your UST. (

Agreed on most points. Agreed on this one, too, but wanted to make special mention of it because it seems to be a trend found in other SG romances - the idea that friendship and romance are mutually exclusive. Rodney & Keller can't be friends, because then they wouldn't be romantic. Sam & Jack are a couple but Daniel is Jack's best friend, because Sam couldn't possibly be. Rodney/Katie, Teyla/Kanaan, Ronon/Keller - there's never any relationship shown between them except the romantic. There's never any bonding over mutual interests or hobbies; there's no real conversations about their relationship, about what they are to each other, what they see in each other, just love confessions/rejections.

Actually, I don't know if this is about romance, or rather the belief that men and women completely lack the grounds to be friends, and can only ever relate to one another romantically. Either way, I kinda wonder about what kind of relationships the SGA writers have with the women in their lives...

[tringasolitaria.livejournal.com]

You know, I think you just said everything I was thinking about this. I actually like the McKay/Keller thing, but I'm still afraid to watch this. I remember on SG-1 I liked Daniel/Vala quite a bit too, all the way up until Unending, and that episode kinda ruined the pairing for me. I'm afraid I'll have the same reaction to this.

I have never ever seen a show where the writers are so, so bad at romantic relationships. *shakes head* Almost every single relationship they've tried has made me cringe, if not immediately than eventually. With the exception of Teyla/Kanaan, but I'm sure that's only because he hasn't been onscreen enough. *grin* I was hoping McKeller would be the exception, but while I like the concept, I think it was badly handled in The Shrine (as you've said) and Tracker, and now this.... *sigh*

[dovil.livejournal.com]

BRAIN TWINS (though you get the more articulate brain, obviously).

I endorse this checklist for President.

[trystings.livejournal.com]

Right now I'm ten minutes into the episode and I'm not sure I can watch any more of this. I just watched Keller being introduced to two old 'pals' of Rodney and she laughed when they made their inappropriate and rude comments and then later chides Rodney for not being humble. What do these two see in each other? What?? At least Rodney was honest about asking her, in his own words: an attractive woman on his arm makes him look less like a loser. But what does Keller see in Rodney? So far she has criticized every aspect of his character and told him THREE times (in ten minutes! Including credits!) she's not interested in physics. And why does she keep calling going to a physics conference together a date?! She's accompanying him to an event. If they go out for dinner later, THAT's the date.

Okay. Sorry, I'll finish watching this and let you know the outcome. I hope it gets better than this.